Tony Kushner on Theatre in America
Playwrights
The playwright talks Angels, access and the future of culture in this country
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Raven Snook: We’re all wary of the ever-escalating cost of theatre tickets — I know producers for Angels in America recently launched an initiative to offer $5 seats to various LGBTQ and HIV/AIDS organizations. Is financial access to theatre something you feel strongly about?
Tony Kushner: I think it’s a huge obstacle for a lot of people, how much it costs to see a show. And it makes being in the commercial arena especially problematic because you’re aware that there are a lot of people who, in my case, are sort of the natural audience for my work, who are going to find it difficult to get in. Any way that it can be made more accessible is really necessary. I think there’s still some huge piece missing in terms of the way we create theatre in this country: the cost of it and lack of government support for it and the limitations that imposes on what’s available. So it’s something that I care about.
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Raven Snook: Where do you go to find new theatre that excites you?
Tony Kushner: I mean in terms of cities — and maybe I shouldn’t say this — but New York is still the theatre capitol of the universe. I see so much exciting, innovative, thrilling work on a regular basis. The two theatres that I have the deepest professional connections with in New York are the Public and New York Theatre Workshop. Between those two theatres, that’s where all of my work has been done. So if I go to the Public or the Workshop I’m almost certain to see extraordinary acting, extraordinary directing, extraordinary new playwriting. But I’ve also seen that at Playwrights Horizons and I’ve seen that at Lincoln Center Theater and I’ve seen that at Manhattan Theatre Club. I’m not dodging the question, really! There’s also Soho Rep, where I first saw An Octoroon, Branden Jacobs-Jenkins’ play, which blew me away. One of the greatest things I’ve ever seen in my entire life was David Greenspan at the Transport Group do his one-man version of Strange Interlude — the entire play! He has to bring it back. Wherever you go in this city people are doing absolutely extraordinary things. I went over the weekend to see The Band’s Visit (I hadn’t seen it at the Atlantic) and I was just floored by it. I mean the subtlety of it and the complexity of it — they did a number of things that I don’t think I’ve ever seen in a musical before. It’s an amazing time to be in American theatre. I think for a while now it’s been a kind of golden age of playwriting. There’s so much extraordinary work that’s being done.
Raven Snook: Many say we’re also in a golden age of television, with all these new platforms allowing writers to create epic series. A lot of them started out as playwrights. Do you worry better-paying screen work will take them away from the theatre?
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Raven Snook: I do get jealous of the support the arts get in other countries, especially in Europe.
Tony Kushner: Not for long! Talk to British theatre producers and they’re all fighting shrinking budgets and austerity. Same for the symphony orchestras and the dance companies and the museums. The notion of the centrality of culture to society has really slipped a lot. It’s grim. But I don’t feel depressed. I believe we’re going to get to a point — it’s taking a long time, but it usually does — where these idiotic culture wars don’t have to be fought any longer. When, I assume, it will be possible for a progressive, centrist President and a progressive, left-leaning Congress to actually create a fully funded National Endowment of the Arts that pumps serious money into culture. That day is not imminent, but I don’t think it’s centuries away either.
Raven Snook: You are an optimistic man, just like Angels is, ultimately, an optimistic work. There’s that oft-quoted line at the end, “the world only spins forward,” that idea of progress. Do you hope the production inspires change? That it’s a political call to arms of sorts?
Tony Kushner: I think a call to arms has to be a call to arms. You have to have a plan in place that you’re calling people to, which is not the case here. But I think it’s an invitation to hope — that would be the best way to describe it. I think it’s a good thing at this particular moment when there are so many loud voices on the other side inviting us to despair.
Raven Snook: You went to university in New York City. We’ve been collecting TDF and TKTS memories in honor of our 50th birthday. Did you used to wait in line for cheap seats?
Tony Kushner: When I was in graduate school at NYU, that was how we went to see things. That or standing room, which I think was $2.50! There was always this excitement at the TKTS line about what was available. I remember standing in lots of lines then, for Shakespeare in the Park, for movies. As a culture, we’ve to a certain extent lost the community-building exercises of standing in long lines with people who are all there to do the same thing that you’re there to do.
Tony Kushner: I’m all for it. There are a lot of high schools that read the play. And cousins of mine brought their 11 year old, which I thought was way too young. But he liked Part I so much, they had to buy him a ticket to see Part II.
Raven Snook: That’s inspiring to hear. I believe a key part of raising the next generation of adventurous theatregoers is exposing kids to shows that might be a bit beyond their grasp. It challenges them and keeps them curious. What’s the worst that could happen? That my kid turns to me at the end of Angels and says, “I don’t get it?”
Tony Kushner: If she does say that, tell her I’m right there with her!
This conversation has been edited for length and clarity.
Click here to purchase tickets to TDF’s 50th Anniversary Gala, which takes place at Gotham Hall on Monday, June 18.
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TDF MEMBERS: At press time, discount tickets were available for Angels in America Part I: Millennium Approaches and Part II: Perestroika. Go here to browse our current offers.
Top image: Tony Kusher. Photo by Joan Marcus.